Addressing the Ben 10 Reboot Part 4: Show/Episode Discussions cont.

[Offbeatcat]

The reboot episodes sound promising. Especially Animomorphosis. I've always wanted to see vilgax and Dr. Animo team up. Plus, who knows what animo could do with alien dna. And if they're meddling with the omnitrix, ben could accidentally turn into the new alien or something.

[Ebomnitrix]

So Alien 11 didn't show up.
Gwen and Max however don't see the Omni-Enhancement until the Grey Matter clip which is Episode 2, Ben's first time using it was accidentally as Diamondhead when he fought Vilgax. They also didn't establish the Omni-Enhancement to them, so it leads to tomorrow if they're going to ask about it or not.

[Offbeatcat]

@ebomnitrix if they don't ask or even acknowledge it as something new, the reboot's second season probably won't do well.

[Ebomnitrix]

Remember Ben 10 is trying to be episodic about their adventures, if you're expecting every episode to be about plot, then you're asking for too much in a Ben 10 series.
If you want a plot based Ben 10 series go back and watch UAF, because OS, OV and the Reboot are mostly episodic and the new show is puzzle piecing.
For a second season, its already off to a great start, so just stay tuned and expect Season 2 to be like Season 1 but just a little bit better. If any of you were expecting more after Omni-Tricked, I'm sorry to disappoint you but if the Omni-Enhancements don't do it for you, then the rest of the show won't then.

[Offbeatcat]

@ebomnitrix i don't want an overarching story, i just want someone like gwen to be like: How'd you do that?

[Ebomnitrix]

The first episode actually explains it, Gwen's watching the fight scene.
Some kid uploaded 9 of 11 minutes of it so enjoy!:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h45ZneHm6PI

[Offbeatcat]

I'll be honest. I was pleased with what i saw. The armored diamond head was awesome, and vilgax was pretty cool. The "tan line" was weird to look at, but it was bit of continuity to the show, so that's nice. I felt the omnitrix timed out too fast, but in retrospect, it's always been unpredictable. Ben's actions didn't feel out of place, though i feel like he should've gone for stinkfly instead of XLR8. so yeah, those are my first impressions. Don't worry @Tactical-Ochoa. You can still dislike it and say its not as good as the original.

[Tactical Ochoa]

@andrew42 said in Addressing the Ben 10 Reboot Part 4: Show/Episode Discussions cont.:

@tactical-ochoa He feels like a 10 year old. The way he approaches things. How he acts and talks. Since you're an adult critic, you've probably overlooked that detail. Ben's personality really doesn't feel out of place to me. He hides the Cadobbit under a BLANKET. I used to do that all the time when i was hiding things from my family. Point is, he's just a kid who found a watch that turns him into aliens. Not a mature adult.

So because Ben acts like a 10-year-old, it makes the reboot more like the original show. That's your reasoning here? Not because of the implementation of story arcs, character development, extreme scenes (such as Zombozo stealing positive energy from people, Zs'Skayr possessing Gwen and almost forcing her to commit suicide against her will, the hints of abuse that Kevin and Charmcaster went through, etc), etc etc etc? In Code Name Kids Next Door, pretty much every kid in that show acts like how actual kids behave. Does that make KND more like the original Ben 10? No because those are very different shows. I saw the 2017 remake of Stephen King's It. One of the many things that I like from that film is that the child actors act like how actual kids behave alongside them being really great at their roles. Does that make the film more like the original Ben 10? No because It is very different from Ben 10.

Also, how does me being an adult have anything to do with how I view fictional child characters. I used to be a kid and I remember how I was like as a kid. I remember how a lot of kids behaved when I was a kid. Hell, I still often see how kids behave today. Let's not forget that the Original Series is also my most favorite show in the franchise so far and I remember first watching it at the age of 11. Also, even though Ben is a 10-year-old kid, he is constantly putting himself in very dangerous situations where one wrong move can mean the death of Ben himself and/or the death of others. He may not be an adult but it is expected for him to be more responsible and mature because he is putting himself in adult-like situations. This is something that we very much see in the original show where often times Ben does act like a 10-year-old kid but also often times shows a lot of maturity and responsibility as a hero. Something that we see more often coming out of Ben in the original show compared to Ben in the reboot show.

Ben may be a child in this show but he is also a fictional character that is constantly putting himself in adult-like situations, just like many other fictional characters regardless of their ages. Also, me being an adult has nothing to do with how I view fictional child characters and the same goes for every other adult critic. Ben being a 10-year-old has very little to do with how the Original Series was like and has very little to do with whether or not the reboot is more like the Original Series.

And yeah, I still think the reboot is not as good as the original and that is very much justifiable to say since that this current Ben 10 show is a reboot that uses the very same exact premise as the original show and even copies a lot, and I mean A LOT, from the original show. As I said plenty of times before, how can fans and viewers not compare the reboot to the original if the reboot keeps reminding them of the original? Even if I don't compare the reboot to the original show, I still don't find it to be a good show. It's decent at best.

[Offbeatcat]

You know, every time we have this discussion, you go back to: "I grew up with ben 10, so i know how it should be." If you had your way, the series would be dead. After the original, nothing. It's 2017, and cartoon network has a very kid friendly image. And you'd rather have little kids get scared and possibly scarred for life by adult scenarios.

[Tactical Ochoa]

@andrew42 Every time? I believe this is the first time I ever stated to you that I grew up with Ben 10. If not, I definitely did not tell you in every discussion that we had that I "grew up with Ben 10 so I know how it should be." I state what I think how Ben 10 should be based on what the franchise did right and wrong and based on all of my knowledge on how to set up a good show/film/video game/etc. How would you know that if I had things my way with Ben 10, the franchise would be dead? I never worked on Ben 10. I hope to get my Ben 10 video game idea made into an actual game in the future and I know that a lot of fans really like my idea. How would you know that me being in charge of making a Ben 10 show would mean the end of Ben 10? What if I make a Ben 10 show or video game and it turns out to be very success and popular?

Also, I never intend to scare little kids and possibly scar them for life with adult scenarios. If I intend to make a kid friendly cartoon, I would keep it kid friendly. If I were to make a Ben 10 show, I want for fans and viewers to like it. I said that Ben often puts himself in adult-like situations. I also said that the original show had some pretty crazy moments in it and I obviously didn't make the original show. That was Man of Action and the very people that worked at Cartoon Network Studios over 10 years ago. The original show still turned out to be very successful and very popular. I was a kid when I first saw Ben 10. I was once never scared and scarred by those very scenes and considering that again the show turned out to be very successful and popular, the same goes for every other kid that liked the original Ben 10. Courage the Cowardly Dog had some pretty scary scenes and kids weren't scarred by it. The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy had some pretty crazy stuff in it and kids weren't scarred by that show. The original Powerpuff Girls was a really violent show with some really crazy scenes in it and even went as far as to have stuff like blood in it. Kids weren't scarred by it.

And no, just because it's 2017 doesn't mean that certain things can and can't be done with Ben 10. The current year has nothing to do with how the entertainment industry should be and what it can and can't do. Ben 10 is part of entertainment art and because of that, it is free to be expressed in however way people want for it to be expressed as. If Cartoon Network and Man of Action wanted to, they could've put Ben 10 on Adult Swim. It worked very well with Samurai Jack after all. Ben 10 could be put on Netflix or could be made by a Japanese animation company (something that I recall plenty of users on this website wanting to see happen to Ben 10). Once again, the current year has nothing to do with how Ben 10 should be.

[jondennison72]

I wonder when their gonna aired more new episodes of Ben 10 reboot season 2 including "Can I keep it"?

[Offbeatcat]

@tactical-ochoa The samurai jack reboot wasn't very good. It changed Jack's character COMPLETELY. He went from a good guy to someone who's possibly insane, what with the hallucinations suggesting suicide. And the finale was an absolute mess, being incredibly rushed and not very interesting.
But seriously, what makes you feel you're so much more capable of making a good show then man of action? Cartoon network doesn't OWN or WRITE Ben 10 anymore. Man of action has complete control over the reboot. They wanted a more simplistic approach. They wanted to be a bit more silly and a bit less serious. They said, and i quote, "In this show, ben's just a kid who found a watch that turns him into aliens, and that's all the viewers need to worry about." That probably wasn't exactly word for word, but the point stands. The people who made the original are making the reboot.

[Ultimate OmniTri]

@andrew42 said in Addressing the Ben 10 Reboot Part 4: Show/Episode Discussions cont.:

@tactical-ochoa The samurai jack reboot wasn't very good. It changed Jack's character COMPLETELY. He went from a good guy to someone who's possibly insane, what with the hallucinations suggesting suicide. And the finale was an absolute mess, being incredibly rushed and not very interesting.
But seriously, what makes you feel you're so much more capable of making a good show then man of action? Cartoon network doesn't OWN or WRITE Ben 10 anymore. Man of action has complete control over the reboot. They wanted a more simplistic approach. They wanted to be a bit more silly and a bit less serious. They said, and i quote, "In this show, ben's just a kid who found a watch that turns him into aliens, and that's all the viewers need to worry about." That probably wasn't exactly word for word, but the point stands. The people who made the original are making the reboot.

Don’t bother arguing with him. It will get you nowhere and is just a waste of a a message on this thread and I’m sure its getting annoying to read Ochoa’s Page Long Essays because I’m annoyed by them so please just end it here.

Anyways, i feel this was a great episode to start off the season, and it seems like the Omni-Enhance function might be the mystery of the season all leading up to The reveal of a new alien. I have a theory that during the episode where Animo and Vilgax team up to steal Omnitrix DNA they somehow accidentally unlock the new alien, or it could just come after Ben has used all 10 Omni-Enhancements. I guess we will see.

[Ebomnitrix]

SAMURAI JACK WASN'T EVEN A REBOOT ANDREW
IT WAS A 5TH SEASON TO CONCLUDE THE SERIES!
And they literally explained why he acted the way he did and it was because of a 50 year gap that drove him insane of not aging or anything, and the season finale was like that because you can only do so much in 10 episodes.

[Offbeatcat]

@ebomnitrix fair enough. It felt like a reboot to me though...

[Offbeatcat]

@ultimate-omnitri Ok, i'll stop fighting ochoa...
also, i had a similiar theory about the 11th alien. Kudos to you man.

[Ben 10 Fan]

@ebomnitrix you've got a lot of those Up Votes for that post, lol.

[Tactical Ochoa]

@andrew42 Doesn't own or write? Cartoon Network still owns Ben 10. They still maintain ownership of it and it's not just Man of Action writing the show. Many of Cartoon Network Studios' writers are working on the Ben 10 reboot and you can find them by going to the Cast and Crew section on the Ben 10 reboot page on IMDB. Man of Action are the Executive Producers of the Ben 10 reboot. The same goes for John Fang, Brian A. Miller, and Jennifer Pelphrey of CN Studios and Tramm Wigzell and Rob Sorcher of Cartoon Network. The Ben 10 reboot is also directed by Nolan Obena for the art department, John McIntyre for animation, and Colin Heck for supervising. It's not just Man of Action that has creative control of the Ben 10 reboot. They may have more control over Ben 10 than they had before but they don't have full creative control. Cartoon Network still maintains control of the reboot themselves as well; especially since that again they still own Ben 10.

I believe I never claimed that I'm more capable of making a good show then Man of Action. If I did, I don't remember. I never made a show so I don't even know for sure unless I give it a try. If I have all the necessary resources that I need as well as an ideally skilled production team to work with, I'd be willing to give it a try. Granted though, you can find Ben 10 fan fiction that's better than the reboot. Hell, I know the perfect Ben 10 fanfic that's a better sequel to the original show than what we got from Alien Force to Omniverse. What I stated is that whatever I think Ben 10 should be is based off of what the franchise did right and wrong and based off of everything that I know on how to make a good show, which is a lot because I'm very analytical when it comes to shows, films, video games, etc and I'm currently working my way up into working as a Game Designer for my future career goal.

Finally, Man of Action says that all the viewers need to worry about is that Ben is just a kid who found a watch and turns into aliens yet the negative reception that the show got from most fans and viewers shows that viewers want more than just a kid that uses a watch to turn into aliens. Man of Action can't just tell viewers that all they need to worry about is this one minor thing about the show because the viewers and Man of Action don't think alike. The fans and viewers want more than just that. They want story. They want character development. They want the show to be action focused and not comedy focused. Etc. Most fans and viewers want the Ben 10 reboot to be Ben 10 and there's a lot more about Ben 10 that defines it than just a kid with an alien watch.

Yeah, Man of Action created the original and they're working on the reboot and most fans and viewers are not happy with what they made. I myself am starting to see Man of Action as the George Lucas of Ben 10.

[Offbeatcat]

@tactical-ochoa Okay, i know @Ebomnitrix and @Ultimate-OmniTri want us to shut up right now. I'll keep my response brief. You should answer this question: What makes you think this show is getting negative reception from it's main audience? It was mostly for kids, and the shorter episodes were meant to fit with the recent cartoon status quo. Also, why do you think everyone shares your opinion? You're starting to sound like a sonic fan, because you just can't seem to accept anything new or different from the original. You act as though teen titans go isn't profitable or popular with the kids. Teen titans go was meant to be funny. This reboot follows that logic. You don't want to accept that this show wasn't meant for you in particular, or really our generation, so you constantly rant about how INFERIOR it is to the original. You can't let us enjoy anything, because you look at things incredibly negatively. I mean, really. We all get it. You don't like the reboot. Maybe if you don't look at it as a reboot, but rather its own thing, you might actually have a little fun. Seriously though, we get it. So please, stop trying to take our positive comments and prove why they are wrong. Please just let us say nice things about the reboot. Anyways, i'll shut up now, because this conversation leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[Offbeatcat]

Anyways, maybe this has been mentioned before, but i want to change the subject...
WHAT'S THIS?